388–8

Conversation No. 388-8

Date: November 8, 1972
Time: 2:05 pm- unknown before 3:28 pm
Location: Executive Office Building

The President met with Charles W. Colson.

The President’s schedule
-Dr. William O. Chase
-The President’s recent trip to office
-The President’s forthcoming trip to office
-Timing


*****************************************************************
 - 30 -

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-07)

Conversation No. 388-8 (cont’d)

[Begin segment reviewed under deed of gift]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 1
[Personal returnable]
[Duration: 20s ]

END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 1
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

1972 election
-Results
-Percentages
-Unreported count
-Vote count
-Majority
-Compared to 1964 election
-Barry M. Goldwater
-Number of votes
-Size
-Compared to past elections
-Percentages
-Compared to 1964 election
-Lyndon B. Johnson
-Margin of victory
-George S. McGovern’s vote
-Percentage
-Georgia
-Connecticut
-Colorado
-California
-Votes
-Predictions
-Margin
-John G. Schmitz
-Massachusetts
-Peace vote
-Watergate
-Areas lost
 - 31 -

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-07)

Conversation No. 388-8 (cont’d)

An unknown person entered at an unknown time after 2:05 pm.

Possible statement by the President
-US News and World Report
-Frederic V. Malek
-Length
-Raymond K. Price, Jr.

The unknown person left at an unknown time before 2:15 pm.

1972 election
-The President’s victory
-Significance
-Size of majority
-Percentage lead
-Johnson’s victory
-Third party candidate
-George C. Wallace
-South
-Social issue
-Republican National Committee
-Complaints
-Reform
-Timing
-The President’s victory
-Significance
-Republican Party
-Complaints
-Robert J. Dole
-Peter H. Domenici
-Robert C. (“Bob”) Wilson
-The President’s support for candidates
-Dwight D. Eisenhower’s efforts
-Compared to the President’s efforts
-Problems
-Desmond J. Barker, Jr.’s view
-Rocky Mountain states
-Gordon L. Allott
-Problems
-New type of conservative
 - 32 -

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-07)

Conversation No. 388-8 (cont’d)

-Independence
-Midwest
-Colorado
-Robert H. Finch
-Rally
-Jack Miller
-Loss
-Earl L. Butz
-J. Caleb Boggs
-Vice President Spiro T. Agnew’s presence
-Visit by the President
-Wilmington
-1970 campaign
-The President’s support
-Middle America
-Old Eastern Establishment
-Value system
-Republican Party

[End segment reviewed under deed of gift]
*****************************************************************


Alexander P. Butterfield entered at 2:15 P.M.

Mail
-Disposition
-“FYIs”
-The President’s schedule
-Florida
-Telephone calls
-Messages
-The President’s workload

Winston S. Churchill
-Biography by Peter de Mendelssohn [The Age of Churchill]
-Library of Congress
-Delivery to the President in Florida

Edward R.G. Heath
 - 33 -

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-07)

Conversation No. 388-8 (cont’d)

-Telephone call to the President
-Forthcoming call to the President
-Timing
-The President’s schedule
-Chase

The President talked with the White House operator at an unknown time between 2:15 pm and
2:18 pm.

[Conversation No. 388-8A]

[See Conversation No. 33-71]

[End of telephone conversation]

Butterfield left at 2:18 pm.


*****************************************************************
[Begin segment reviewed under deed of gift]

1972 election
-The President’s strategy
-Visits to states
-Value
-House of Representatives
-Senate
-Results
-Mandate for President
-New constituency
-Significance
-Comparison to Franklin D. Roosevelt in 1932
-Eastern Establishment
-Congress
-[American Party] “Birchers”
-Washington state
-Utah
-Oregon
-California
-Alaska
 - 34 -

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-07)

Conversation No. 388-8 (cont’d)

-California
-New York
-Ohio
-Ray C. Bliss
-Margin of votes
-Illinois
-Indiana
-Florida
-Margin
-Michigan
-Results
-The President’s supporters
-Busing issue
-Paul Hall’s efforts
-Voting analysis
-Charles H. Percy
-McGovern [?]
-Illinois
-Richard B. Ogilvie
-The President’s campaign
-Support for other candidates

[End segment reviewed under deed of gift]
*****************************************************************


Stephen B. Bull entered at an unknown time after 2:18 pm.

Robert H. Finch
-Location
-The President's forthcoming telephone call
-Office location
-West Wing
-Meeting with the President
-Timing

Bull left at an unknown time before 2:35 p.m.


*****************************************************************
 - 35 -

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-07)

Conversation No. 388-8 (cont’d)

[Begin segment reviewed under deed of gift]

1972 election
-Ticket splitting
-Colson’s recent conversation with Elliot L. Richardson
-Massachusetts
-Providence, Rhode Island
-The President’s attendance at rally
-Herbert F. DeSimone
-John H. Chafee
-Crowd response
-New Majority
-Republican Senators
-Clifford P. Case
-Edward W. Brooke
-Percy
-New Majority

[End segment reviewed under deed of gift]
*****************************************************************


The President talked with the White House operator at an unknown time between 2:18 pm and
2:35 pm.

[Conversation No. 388-8B]

[See Conversation No. 33-72]

Heath
-Location
-Buckingham Palace
-The President's possible telephone call

World leaders
-Congratulations
-Publicity
-Ronald L. Ziegler
-Importance
 - 36 -

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-07)

Conversation No. 388-8 (cont’d)


*****************************************************************
[Begin segment reviewed under deed of gift]

1972 election
-The President’s victory
-McGovern
-World leaders
-Dole
-Significance
-Margin of victory
-Number of states
-Number of votes
-Percentages
-Compared to 1964 election
-Compared to 1936 election
-Roosevelt
-Compared to 1964 election
-Johnson
-Number of states
-Media commentary
-McGovern
-Collapse of Democratic Party Coalition
-1932 election
-Desertions
-Urban dwellers
-Blue collar workers
-Catholics
-Remnants
-Blacks
-Jews
-Interests
-The President’s victory
-Control of political machine
-Institutionalization
-Peace
-Compared to 1936 election
-Roosevelt
-Congressional victories
-Executive power
 - 37 -

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-07)

Conversation No. 388-8 (cont’d)

-Conflict with Congress
-Strict construction
-Republican Party
-House of Representatives races
-Net gains
-Wilson
-Problems
-Candidates
-Final figures
-1968 election
-Problems
-Candidates

[End segment reviewed under deed of gift]
*****************************************************************


Watergate
-Post 1972 election period
-Edward M. Kennedy investigation
-Congress
-Possible public perception
-Possible effect
-Democratic Party


*****************************************************************
[Begin segment reviewed under deed of gift]

1972 election
-McGovern and R. Sargent Shriver
-Message to the President
-Response
-Patrick J. Buchanan draft
-Price’s draft
-The President’s revision
-Wording
-Thelma C. (“Pat”) Nixon
-Eleanor (Stegeburg) McGovern
-Rest
 - 38 -

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-07)

Conversation No. 388-8 (cont’d)

-Cooperation
-The President’s victory
-Public confidence
-Press and media relations
-Washington Post
-Columbia Broadcast System [CBS]
-Contacts
-CBS
-Telephone calls
-Walter L. Cronkite, Jr.
-Predictions
-Mistakes
-McGovern
-Issues
-Watergate and peace
-Massachusetts
-Importance

[End segment reviewed under deed of gift]
*****************************************************************


An unknown person entered at an unknown time after 2:18 pm.

The President’s schedule
-Meeting with Finch

The unknown person left at an unknown time before 2:35 pm.


*****************************************************************
[Begin segment reviewed under deed of gift]

1972 election
-Watergate issue
-Economic issue
-McGovern’s handling

Finch entered at 2:35 pm.
 - 39 -

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-07)

Conversation No. 388-8 (cont’d)

Greetings

1972 election
-The President’s victory
-Majority
-Voter turnout
-Size
-Percentage
-Compared to 1964 election
-Johnson
-American Party
-“Bircher” [John G. Schmitz]
-Votes in California
-National vote
-Utah
-Washington state
-Wisconsin
-Joseph McCarthy
-Montana
-Louisiana
-Idaho
-Radical right strength
-Peace issue
-McGovern’s handling
-Massachusetts
-Watergate
-National impact
-Finch’s assessment
-California
-Finch’s schedule
-Television [TV]
-Election night calls
-John B. Connally
-Frank L. Rizzo
-Milton S. Shapp
-Nelson A. Rockefeller
-Mood
-Sportmanship
-1960, 1964, 1968 nominations
-California
 - 40 -

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-07)

Conversation No. 388-8 (cont’d)

-Republican Party candidates
-Finch’s assessment
-The President’s efforts
-Fundraising dinners
-Ontario
-Endorsements
-Ronald W. Reagan
-Complaints
-Organization
-State legislature
-Problems
-Charles Conrad
-Voter registration
-Democrats well organized
-Reagan
-Conrad
-[First Name Unknown] Campell
-Unknown person
-San Diego seats
-Unknown people
-Republican Party
-Decline in apparatus
-Pete Wilson
-Media relations
-Networks
-Herbert G. Klein
-John A. Scali
-Unknown TV commentator
-Republican losses
-Complaints
-California
-The President’s assistance with fundraising
-Bob Wilson
-Replacement
-Campaign expenditures in 1971
-H.R. (“Bob”) Haldeman
-Areas of expenditure
-Publicity, research, policy committees
-Republican Party
-National Chairman
 - 41 -

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-07)

Conversation No. 388-8 (cont’d)

-The President’s conversation with C. Moley
-Name change
-South

[End segment reviewed under deed of gift]
*****************************************************************


Colson
-Vacation plans
-Family
-Boston


*****************************************************************
[Begin segment reviewed under deed of gift]

1972 election
-Massachusetts
-Tricia Nixon Cox
-Julie Nixon Eisenhower
-Smith College
-[Dwight] David Eisenhower II
-Amherst College
-Edward R.F. Cox
-Harvard University

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 9
[Deed of gift – Privacy]
[Duration: 3s ]

END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 9
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[End segment reviewed under deed of gift]
*****************************************************************


Second term reorganization
 - 42 -

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-07)

Conversation No. 388-8 (cont’d)

-The President’s opponents
-Harvard University
-Massachusetts Institute of Technology [MIT]
-Exception
-John F. Collins

Colson’s schedule

Second term reorganization
-Appointments
-Ethnic groups
-Italian-Americans, Polish-Americans
-Department of Labor
-Labor leader
-Compared to Commerce Department
-Businessman
-James D. Hodgson
-Agreement
-George Meany
-Frank E. Fitzsimmons
-Paul Hall
-Abraham A. Ribicoff
-Requirement
-Political ability
-Hall
-Indictment
-The President’s view
-Compared to Meany
-Education
-Personality

Press relations
-Colson’s forthcoming speech to New England newspaper editors
-Washington Post
-1972 election
-Washington Post
-George S. McGovern
-Washington, DC

Colson left at 2:50 pm.
 - 43 -

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-07)

Conversation No. 388-8 (cont’d)



****************************************************************
[Begin segment reviewed under deed of gift]

1974 election
-Republican Party
-California
-Finch’s political plans
-Governorship
-Senate
-Decision
-The President’s recommendations
-Senate
-Alan Cranston
-Governorship
-Polls
-Cranston
-Reagan
-Congressional delegation

[End segment reviewed under deed of gift]
*****************************************************************


Manolo Sanchez entered at an unknown time after 2:50 pm.

Refreshments

Sanchez left at an unknown time before 3:00 pm.

1972 election
-Press relations
-Los Angeles Times

Norman Chandler
-Health
-Rose Mary Woods
-Cancer
-James S. Copley
 - 44 -

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-07)

Conversation No. 388-8 (cont’d)

-Leukemia
-Effect on speaking ability
-1972 election
-Notes
-Possible telephone call from the President
-Gratitude for support


*****************************************************************
[Begin segment reviewed under deed of gift]

1972 election
-California
-The President’s supporters
-Reaction
-Republican Party
-Reagan
-Relations with the President
-H. R. 1
-Family Assistance Plan [FAP]
-Reagan’s telephone call to John D. Ehrlichman
-Intelligence
-Henry Salvatori
-1976 primaries
-Agnew

1976 campaign
-Connally
-Reagan
-Agnew
-Compared to Reagan
-Primaries
-Percy
-Reagan
-Salvatori
-Senate
-Age
-Experience in foreign policy
-Trips for the President
 - 45 -

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-07)

Conversation No. 388-8 (cont’d)

Finch’s political plans
-California
-Timing
-Fundraising
-Edward W. Carter
-David Packard
-Sponsored dinner
-Californians in the White House
-Haldeman
-Finch
-Klein
-The President’s role
-Campaign organization
-Polls
-Klein
-Shriver
-Jack J. Valenti
-James S. Copley
-Gordon Luce
-Valenti
-Republican Party
-Choice of office
-Governorship
-John V. Tunney
-Democrats
-Candidates
-Divisions
-Bob Moretti
-Joseph Alioto
-George Moscone
-Jerome R. Waldie
-Edmund G. Brown, Jr.
-Senate seats
-Democrat control
-Cranston
-Shriver, Tunney
-Minorities
-Finch
-Money
-Pace
 - 46 -

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-07)

Conversation No. 388-8 (cont’d)

-Governorship
-Edwin Reinecke
-Otis Chander
-Survey
-Finch
-Intelligence
-Polls
-Republicans
-Polls
-Senate race
-Cranston
-Houston Flournoy
-Barry M. Goldwater, Jr.
-Robert B. Mathias
-Caspar W. (“Cap”) Weinberger

1976 campaign
-John N. Mitchell
-Rockefeller
-Reagan
-Governorship
-Theodore H. (“Teddy”) White’s view
-Agnew
-Reagan
-Percy
-Reagan
-Age
-Reagan
-Benjamin Disraeli

1972 election
-Youth vote
-Hispanic vote
-New York
-Puerto Rico
-Chicanos
-Cubans
-Texans

Finch’s political plans
 - 47 -

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-07)

Conversation No. 388-8 (cont’d)

-Constituents
-Jews
-New Majority
-Labor
-International Brotherhood of Teamsters
-Building trades
-Catholics
-Democrats

[End segment reviewed under deed of gift]
*****************************************************************


Issues
-Ratios
-Capital punishment
-Ziegler’s conversation with the President
-Marijuana
-Busing

Second term reorganization
-Resignations
-Handling
-California
-White House
-Tone
-Letters
-Recent Cabinet meeting
-William P. Rogers
-Tone
-Extent
-Lyndon B. Johnson, John F. Kennedy holdovers
-Budget considerations
-Finch’s conversation with Caspar W. (“Cap”) Weinberger and George
P. Schultz
-Reduction in Force [RIF]
-Recent Cabinet meeting
-Timing
-Unknown person’s view
-Cabinet
 - 48 -

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-07)

Conversation No. 388-8 (cont’d)

-Work in 1972
-Post-meeting conversation
-Tone
-Cabinet
-Forthcoming meetings with the President

The President talked with Edward Heath between 3:08 pm and 3:11 pm.

[Conversation No. 388-8C]

[See Conversation No. 33-73]

[End of telephone conversation]


*****************************************************************
[Begin segment reviewed under deed of gift]

1972 election
-The President’s victory
-Impact on world leaders
-Johnson 1964 victory
-Political problems
-Great Society
-Vietnam War
-Johnson’s attitude
-The President’s visit
-Shoreham Hotel
-Oval Office
-Contrast to McGovern
-Symbolism

Finch’s political plans
-California
-Decision
-Timing

[End segment reviewed under deed of gift]
*****************************************************************
 - 49 -

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-07)

Conversation No. 388-8 (cont’d)


Second term reorganization
-Cabinet resignations
-Timing
-George W. Romney’s concern
-Romney, John A. Volpe
-Duration of service
-State government
-Dwight Eisenhower Cabinet
-Franklin D. Roosevelt
-Eisenhower
-Arthur Summerfield, George T. Humphrey


*****************************************************************
[Begin segment reviewed under deed of gift]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 15
[Personal returnable]
[Duration: 2m 12s ]

END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 15
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[End segment reviewed under deed of gift]
*****************************************************************


Finch’s political plans
-Scenario
-Finch’s effort


*****************************************************************
[Begin segment reviewed under deed of gift]

Finch’s political plans
-Scenario
-California
 - 50 -

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-07)

Conversation No. 388-8 (cont’d)

-Timing
-White House staff
-Surrogates
-Klein
-California
-National Association of Broadcasters
-New York
-California
-Money making
-Advisory Commission on Intergovernmental Relations [ACIR]

Republican Party
-Reform
-Colson
-The President’s actions
-Timing
-Problems
-Division
-Senate and House of Representatives campaigns
-White House
-Support for candidates
-Surrogates
-Importance
-Louie B. Nunn
-The President’s efforts

Finch’s political plans
-California
-Challenge
-Organization

Unknown person
-Revenue sharing
-Support for the President
-Possible appointment
-Sub-cabinet
-Finch’s forthcoming conversation with Haldeman

The President’s schedule
 - 51 -

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-07)

Conversation No. 388-8 (cont’d)

1972 election
-Past elections
-1960, 1962, 1968

White

[End segment reviewed under deed of gift]
*****************************************************************


Finch left at an unknown time before 3:11 pm.