822–11

Conversation No. 822-11

Date: December 13, 1972
Time: 4:15 pm – 4:55 pm
Location: Oval Office

The President met with Henry M. (“Scoop”) Jackson.

Greetings

Jackson’s trip to Europe and Middle East
-Speech
-Strategic Arms Limitation Talks [SALT]
-Golda Meir
-Meeting with Jackson
-Greetings from the President
-Toughness, compassion
-Political intentions
-Compared to Indira Gandhi
-India
-Jackson’s view
-Relations with US
-Dinner for Gandhi, November 4, 1971
-Invasion of East Pakistan
-The President’s toast
-Jawaharlal Nehru
-Gandhi’s toast
-Tone
-US wealth
-Ideals, morals
-The President’s and Jackson’s views
-Pakistan

Jackson’s recent trip to Europe and Middle East
-Meeting with [Shah of Iran] Mohammed Reza Pahlavi
-Greetings from the President
-Iran
 -21-

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-08)

Conversation No. 822-11 (cont’d)

-Pro-Western orientation
-Relations with India
-Relations with Iraq
-Soviet Union
-Urban guerrillas
-Soviet Union
-Defense spending
-Effect on Saudi Arabia
-Great power role
-Helicopters, concords
-Saudi Arabia
-Political situation
-Jackson’s view
-John B. Connally’s trip

Manolo Sanchez entered at an unknown time after 4:15 pm.

Refreshments
-Tea

Sanchez left at an unknown time before 4:47 pm.

Jackson’s recent trip to Europe and Middle East
-Saudi Arabia
-Connally’s forthcoming trip
-[Faisal, King of Saudi Arabia] Malik Faisal ibn Abd al-Aziz al-Saud
-Jackson’s telephone call to Connally
-Business
-Connally’s briefings of the President
-Energy issue
-Jackson’s meeting with Peter M. Flanigan
-Departmental disputes
-Interior Department
-Commerce Department
-Atomic Energy Commission [AEC]
-Defense Department [DOD]
-State Department
-White House staff
-Cuts
-Role
 -22-

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-08)

Conversation No. 822-11 (cont’d)


Sanchez entered and left at an unknown time before 4:47 pm.

-White House staff
-Policy
-Oil, nuclear
-US-Soviet Union gas deal
-Jackson’s possible conversation with John D. Ehrlichman
-Handling
-James E. Akins
-Flanigan
-State Department
-Transportation Department
-Unknown person
-George P. Shultz [?]


***********************************************************************
BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 8
[National Security]
[Duration: 3s ]
[Subject: Intelligence]

END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 8
***********************************************************************


Energy
-Jackson’s possible conversation with Ehrlichman
-Handling
-Departments, agencies

Middle East
-Persian Gulf
-Jackson’s concern
-Iraq
-Soviet Union
-Oil reserves
-Iraq
-Saudi Arabia
 -23-

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-08)

Conversation No. 822-11 (cont’d)

-Compared to the US
-Population
-Persian Gulf
-Oil
-Soviet Union
-Intentions
-Communism
-Influence on oil supplies
-Mohammed Mossadegh
-Western Europe
-Japan
-Iran-Saudi Arabia relations
-State Department
-Jackson’s conversation with Connally
-Shah’s view
-Basis of mutual enmity
-Race, ethnicity
-Arabs
-Kuwait
-Population
-Saudi Arabia
-Political situation
-Projected revenue
-1980
-Persian Gulf
-US balance of payments deficit
-Israeli-Arab conflict
-Resolution
-Shah’s view
-Saudi Arabia’s position
-Algeria’s position
-Syria’s position
-US position
-Saudi position


***********************************************************************
BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 10
[National Security]
[Duration: 27s ]
 -24-

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-08)

Conversation No. 822-11 (cont’d)

[Subject: Saudi Arabia, Iran]

END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 10
***********************************************************************


Middle East
-Ambassadorship to Iran
-Richard M. Helms
-Retirement
-Age
-Joseph S. Farland
-Intelligence background
-Persian Gulf
-Conversation with Jackson


***********************************************************************
BEGIN WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 11
[National Security]
[Duration: 32s ]
[Subject: Middle East]

END WITHDRAWN ITEM NO. 11
***********************************************************************


Middle East
-Statistics on oil
-Akens
-Flanigan

Energy
-US position
-Oil prices
-Arab’s position
-Intention not to pump
-Conversations with Jackson
-Shah’s view
-Saudi Arabia
 -25-

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-08)

Conversation No. 822-11 (cont’d)

-US science and technology
-Research and development [R & D]
-Coal
-Gassification
-Liquification
-Oil shale
-Colorado
-US oil companies
-Oil companies
-Advertising
-Geothermal
-Nuclear power
-Incentives to drill
-Canada
-Canada
-Natural gas reserves
-Liquefied Natural Gas [LNG]
-Soviet Union
-US dependence on foreign sources
-Oil
-1972 compared to 1980
-Natural gas
-Algeria
-Soviet Union

Jackson’s trip to Yugoslavia, Bulgaria, Romania and Czechoslovakia
-Meetings with Josip Broz Tito and other heads of state
-Tito
-Ethnic problems
-Background
-Croatia
-Serbs, Slovenes
-Age
-View of the President
-Drinking
-Brandy
-Succession
-Leonid I. Brezhnev
-Doctrine
-Succession
 -26-

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-08)

Conversation No. 822-11 (cont’d)

-Soviet Union

Bulgarians
-Compared to Soviets

The President spoke with the White House operator at an unknown time between 4:15 pm and
4:47 pm.

[See Conversation No. 34-64]

[End of telephone conversation]

Eastern Europe
-Trade with US
-Czechoslovakia
-Soviet Union
-US technical assistance and exchanges
-Bulgaria
-Czechoslovakia
-Doctors
-Managerial help
-Romania
-Jackson’s meeting with Nicholae Ceausescu
-Communism
-Internal conditions
-Compared to the Soviet Union
-Ceausescu’s relations with US
-Aid
-Bulgaria
-Compared to the Soviet Union
-Slavs
-Czechoslovakia
-US technical aid
-View of US science, technology and economic output
-People
-East-West trade
-Ideology

Second term reorganization
-National defense and arms control
 -27-

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-08)

Conversation No. 822-11 (cont’d)

-Elliot L. Richardson
-Jonathan Moore
-Jackson’s position on Institute of Politics, John F. Kennedy School of
Government [Harvard University]
-Dr. Jerome B. Weisner
-Compared to William Miller
-John Sherman Cooper
-Jackson’s conversation with Richardson
-Laurence E. (“Larry”) Lynn, Jr.
-Resignation
-Cambodia invasion
-The President’s conversation with Richardson
-Department of Health, Education and Welfare [HEW]
-DOD
-Lynn
-Cambodia
-Loyalty
-Position
-Influences
-DOD
-William P. Clements, Jr.
-John A. Tower
-Meeting with Jackson
-Richardson
-Conversation with Jackson
-Ivy League
-SALT
-Hard and soft lines
-State Department
-Melvin R. Laird
-William P. Rogers
-Intelligence
-Loyalty
-Managerial ability
-Clements
-Influences
-Arms control
-Arms Control and Disarmament Agency [ACDA]
-Jackson’s recommendations
-Jackson’s conversation with Alexander M. Haig, Jr.
 -28-

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-08)

Conversation No. 822-11 (cont’d)

-Elimination
-Staff
-Cuts
-Budget
-SALT delegation
-U. Alexis Johnson
-Chief negotiator
-Rogers’s telephone call to Jackson
-Instructions
-Cambodia, the President’s May 8, 1972 decision
-Loyalty
-Foreign Service Officer [FSO]
-The President’s conversation with Jackson
-Staff
-Cuts
-Disloyalty
-George S. McGovernites
-Weisner
-Massachusetts Institute of Technology [MIT]
-American Federation of Scientists
-Lt. Gen. Edward L.Rowny
-Jackson’s conversation with Haig
-Europe
-Gen. Creighton W. Abrams, Jr.’s view
-Jackson’s conversation with Henry A. Kissinger

Stephen B. Bull entered at an unknown time after 4:15 pm.

The President’s schedule

Bull left at an unknown time before 4:47 pm.

-Education
-Ph.D.
-Abrams
-Upgrade
-Air Force
-Upgrade
-Four stars
-Haig’s view
 -29-

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-08)

Conversation No. 822-11 (cont’d)

-Education
-John Hopkins University
-B.S.
-Air Force Academy
-B.S.
-Yale University
-Masters Degrees
-Engineering, political science
-Ph.D.
-Public administration
-Three star status
-Age
-Kenneth E. BeLieu
-John C. Stennis’s and Jackson’s view
-Under Secretary of the Army
-Congressional relations

Congressional relations
-Senate
-National security “loss”
-Democrats
-Southerners
-Gordon L. Allott’s seat
-Delaware
-Iowa
-Colorado
-Maine
-William D. Hathaway
-Edmund S. Muskie
-Margaret Chase Smith
-Offset
-Oklahoma
-Kentucky
-Walter (Dee) Huddleston
-Compared to Cooper
-William L. Scott
-Compared to [William B. Spong, Jr.]
-Georgia
-North Carolina
-Jesse A. Helms
 -30-

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-08)

Conversation No. 822-11 (cont’d)


The President talked with Milton Friedman between 4:47 pm and 4:48 pm.

[Conversation No. 822-11B]

[See Conversation No. 34-65]

[End of telephone conversation]

Congressional relations
-Cooper
-Ambassador-at-large
-“Fuzzy wuzzy world”
-National Atlantic Treaty Organization [NATO]
-Miller
-US troops in Europe
-NATO
-Loyalty
-Georgetown influence
-Influence on votes
-Relationship with Jackson
-Antiballistic missiles [ABM]
-SALT amendment
-Parity
-Miller
-Senate staffs
-Size
-Influences
-Council for a Livable World
-Administrative and legislative assistants
-Mail, telephone calls
-Lobbies
-Second term
-First term
-Edward M. Kennedy
-Tone
-Timing

Second term reorganization
-Secretary of the Army
 -31-

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

Tape Subject Log
(rev. June-08)

Conversation No. 822-11 (cont’d)

-BeLieu
-Stennis’s view
-Congressional relations
-Democrats
-Background
-Politics
-Bryce N. Harlow
-Retirement from Army
-Korean War
-Loyalty
-US Army Colonel
-Congressional relations
-DOD
-Haig’s view
-Robert F. Froehlke
-Loyalty
-Quote from the Illiad
-ACDA

Jackson’s schedule
-Connally
-Ehrlichman
-ACDA
-Haig
-Kissinger
-Relationship with the President

Second term reorganization
-Haig
-Value
-Abrams

Jackson left at 4:53 pm.