225–39

Conversation No. 225-39

Date: November 16, 1972
Time: Unknown between 2:23 pm - 3:45 pm
Location: Camp David Hard Wire

The President met with H. R. (“Bob”) Haldeman and John D. Ehrlichman.
 -24-

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

Tape Subject Log
(rev. Feb.-08)

Conversation No. 225-39 (cont’d)


Second term reorganization
-William P. Rogers tenure as Secretary of State
-Haldeman’s forthcoming conversation with Rodgers
-Plans
-National Security
-The President's decision
-Changes in personnel
-Time served in Cabinet
-Leadership
-George W. Romney
-John A. Volpe
-Peter G. Peterson
-Departures
-Roger’s career
-Other Cabinet changes
-Rogers C. B. Morton
-Earl L. Butz
-Richard G. Kleindienst
-George P. Shultz
-Tenures
-Length
-Shultz
-Kleindienst
-Butz
-Peterson
-Retentions
-Justice Department
-Butz
-Natural resources
-Schultz
-Economics
-The President’s forthcoming conversation with Rogers
-Morton
-Review of reorganization
-Confidentiality
-Melvin R. Laird
-Successor to Rogers
-The President’s forthcoming conversation with Rogers
-[David] Kenneth Rush
 -25-

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

Tape Subject Log
(rev. Feb.-08)

Conversation No. 225-39 (cont’d)

-Nelson A. Rockefeller
-John B. Connally
-Work with Rogers
-Rush
-Continuity
-The President’s forthcoming conversation with Rogers
-Rogers’s career
-Vietnam
-Settlement agreement
-Length in office
-Middle East
-Review of career
-Departure
-Leadership
-The President’s personal interest
-Persuasion
-Work with Henry A. Kissinger
-Vietnam
-Settlement agreement
-Credit
-Haldeman’s forthcoming conversation with Rogers
-The President’s forthcoming conversation with Rogers
-Chart
-The President’s deliberation
-Replacement
-Connally
-Rockefeller
-Continuity
-Rush
-Conditions

Norman Chandler
-Health
-The President's recent phone call
-Note

Second term reorganization
-Peter M. Flanigan
-Retention
-Treasury Department
 -26-

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

Tape Subject Log
(rev. Feb.-08)

Conversation No. 225-39 (cont’d)

-White House
-[Connally’s] view
-State Department
-Treasury Department
-[Confirmation] problem
-Herbert G. Klein
-Note
-Resignation
-Forthcoming conversation with Haldeman
-Communications office
-Press Secretary
-Changes in supervision


*****************************************************************
[Begin segment reviewed under deed of gift]

-Possible job offer
-RNC communications director

[End segment reviewed under deed of gift]
*****************************************************************


-Klein’s qualifications
-Ambassadorship to Mexico
-RNC
-Reorganization
-Ambassadorship to Mexico
-Private enterprise
-US Information Agency [USIA]
-James Leonard Reinsh
-Connally recommendation
-Support for the President
-1972 election
-Cox Broadcasting Corporation endorsement
-Liberalism
-John F. Kennedy media advisor
-Liberalism
-Federal Bureau of Investigation [FBI] director
 -27-

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

Tape Subject Log
(rev. Feb.-08)

Conversation No. 225-39 (cont’d)

-Jerry V. Wilson
-The President’s decision
-Secondary education
-Egil (“Bud”) Krogh, Jr.’s memorandum
-Military service
-US Marine Corps
-Completion
-Qualifications
-Street crime
-Kidnapping
-Counterfeiting
-Airplane vandalism [?]


Second term reorganization
-L[ouis] Patrick Gray, III
-Job offer
-Administrative ability
-Under Secretaryship
-Religion
-Cabinet
-Catholic appointees
-Gray
-Roy L. Ash
-William E. Miller
-Irish-American, Italian-American
-Shultz
-Visibility
-[Helena M. (“Obie”) Shultz
-Contacts with Catholic clergy
-Ash
-Shultz
-Ash
-Shultz
-Contacts with Jesuit Catholic clergy
-Flanigan, Ash
-Italian-American appointees
-Candidates
-Chicago Law firm
-Carl A. Pelletieri [?]
 -28-

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

Tape Subject Log
(rev. Feb.-08)

Conversation No. 225-39 (cont’d)

-Navaroski [sp?] [first name unknown]
-Whitcomb [first name unknown]
-Heinschweigel [sp?][first name unknown]
-Commerce Department
-Fredrick B. Dent
-Textile industry
-Support for the President
-Age
-Business Council
-Gray
-Internal Revenue Service [IRS]
-Experience
-Problems
-Tax bar
-IRS
-William J. Casey
-State Department
-Importance
-Loyalty
-Johnnie M. Walters
-Krogh
-Unknown person
-Dean of Duke University Law School, Joseph [T. Sneed]
-Possible Supreme Court Appointment
-Qualification
-Political responsiveness
-Franklyn C. (“Lyn”) Nofziger
-Casey
-Gray
-State Department
-Political signals
-Casey’s interest
-Connally
-Under Secretary of State
-Search for candidate
-Casey’s aid
-Catholics
-Gray
-Publicity
-Ash
 -29-

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

Tape Subject Log
(rev. Feb.-08)

Conversation No. 225-39 (cont’d)

-Shultz
-Office of Management and Budget [OMB]
-Cabinet rank
-Possible name change
-Office of Executive Management
-Chet Holifield
-State Department
-Under Secretary
-Casey
-Foreign Service Officers [FSOs]
-Frank C. Carlucci
-Under Secretary for Political Affiars
- FSOs
-Appointment
-Political attitude
-Chief of Protocol
-James J. Reynolds
-United Nations [UN] ambassadorship
-European Economic Community [EEC]
-[Peterson]
-North Atlantic Treaty Organization [NATO] ambassadorship
-Peterson
-Reaction of militarists, economists
-David M. Kennedy
-NATO ambassadorship
-George H.W. Bush
-Treasury Department
-Deputy Secretary of Treasury
-Bush
-Shultz
-Work with Ways and Means Committee
-Charls E. Walker
-Texas
-Defense Department
-Elliot L. Richardson
-Advantages
-Department of Health, Education and Welfare [HEW]
-Family Assistance Plan [FAP]
-Busing
-William P. Clements, Jr.
 -30-

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

Tape Subject Log
(rev. Feb.-08)

Conversation No. 225-39 (cont’d)

-Toughness
-Connally
-Richardson
-Loyalty
-Plans on HEW
-Caspar W. (“Cap”) Weinberger
-Attorney General
-Deputy
-William D. Ruckelshaus
-Environmental Protection Agency [EPA]
-John N. Mitchell
-Miles J. Ambrose
-Kleindienst
-White House staff
-Ruckelshaus
-Possible US Senate candidacy
-EPA
-Department of Natural Resources [DNR]
-Butz
-Political ambitions
-Credibility with environmentalists
-Department of Housing and Urban Development [HUD]
-John F. Collins
-Background
-Irish Catholicism
-William D. Eberle
-Liberalism
-Necessity for attacks on model cities, Office of Economic Opportunity
[OEO]
-Support
-Community relations
-States
-Housing
-New approach
-Public housing
-Appointment
-Italian-American
-Richard P. Cooley
-Background
-Catholicism
 -31-

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

Tape Subject Log
(rev. Feb.-08)

Conversation No. 225-39 (cont’d)

-California
-John W. Arbuckle
-Stanford University
-Transportation Department
-Italian-American
-HUD
-Herbert F. DeSimone
-Past work
-Performance
-Italian-American
-Justice Department
-Southerners
-Southerners
-Solicitor General
-Charles A. Wright
-University of Texas
-Sneed
-Duke University
-Stanford University
-Wright
-Expertise
-Constitutional law
-Law Enforcement Assistance Administration [LEAA]
-List
-Fredric V. Malek
-James T. Lynn
-Under Secretary of the Commerce Department
-Possible under secretary of HUD
-Administrative duties
-Super secretary
-Promotion
-Undersecretaries
-Importance
-Clayton Y. Cutter
-Nebraska
-Transportation Department
-Labor Department
-George Meany
-Opposition to labor leader
-Charles W. Colson
 -32-

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

Tape Subject Log
(rev. Feb.-08)

Conversation No. 225-39 (cont’d)

-Assistant Secretaries
-Donald F. Rodgers
-Labor leaders’ contact with the President
-Colson’s office
-Channel
-Secretary of Labor role
-Max M. Fisher’s view
-Jew
-Writing and research staff
-Southerner
-Richard W. Brannon
-HEW
-Patrick J. Buchanan
-Labor
-Leaders’ contact with the President
-Channel
-Colson
-Leonard Garment
-Role
-Boards, commissions
-Interior Department
-Appointee age
-Malek
-Interest in cabinet position
-Background
-Ethnic background
-Yugoslavia, Czech
-Catholicism
-Grandfather
-Qualifications
-Experience
-[Harvard University Business School]
-Business
-[Triangle Corporation?]
-Management consulting
-Under Secretary of Transportation
-Under Secretary of HUD
-Ash
-Background
-California
 -33-

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

Tape Subject Log
(rev. Feb.-08)

Conversation No. 225-39 (cont’d)

-South Carolina
-Business
-California
-Interior Department
-HUD
-Transportation Department
-Commerce Department
-Dent
-Southern background
-Transportation Department
-HUD
-Requirements
-Political and management skill
-Rural development
-Urban development
-Transportation department
-Ethnic
-Ash
-State Department
-Compared to Casey
-Toughness
-Transportation Department
-Interior Department
-Energy crisis
-Eberle
-Business experience
-John C. Whitaker
-Eberle
-Western background
-Morton
-Ambassadorship to Canada, Australia
-English speaking places
-Ambassadorship to NATO
-Interior Department
-Energy crisis
-Connally
-Morton
-Connally’s view
-Bush
-Bush
 -34-

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

Tape Subject Log
(rev. Feb.-08)

Conversation No. 225-39 (cont’d)

-Under Secretary of Treasury
-RNC chairmanship
-Treasury Department
-Interior Department

Energy crisis
-Interagency coordination
-Domestic Council
-The President’s involvement
-Timing
-Post-1972 election
-Natural gas prices
-Arms Control and Disarmament Agency [ACDA]
-Qualifications
-Negotiating
-Gerard C. Smith
-Qualification
-Order taking
-Budget cut
-Henry M. (“Scoop”) Jackson
-Staff
-Opposition to administration
-Lynn
-Negotiating skills
-Knowledge
-Arms
-Foreign trade
-Strategic Arms Limitation Treaty [SALT] II negotiations
-SALT negotiations
-Knowledge of disarmament
-William C. Foster, Paul H. Nitze
-Casey
-Appointment
-Bush
-Kissinger
-Under Secretary of Treasury
-RNC chairmanship
-Central Intelligence Agency [CIA]
-Dr. James R. Schlesinger
-Bush
 -35-

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

Tape Subject Log
(rev. Feb.-08)

Conversation No. 225-39 (cont’d)

-Treasury Department
-Under secretary
-Secretary
-Under secretary
-Importance
-EPA
-Ruckelshaus
-Whitaker
-Support for the President
-Compared to Ruckelshaus
-Credibility
-Environmentalists
-Toughness
-National Park Service
-Whitaker
-Importance of job
-Ronald H. Walker
-Interior Department
-Whitaker
-Compared to Ruckelshaus
-Loyalty
-Ruckelshaus
-Political ambitions
-Illinois Senate race
-1974 election
-Adlai E. Stevenson, III
-Everett M. Dirksen
-Cost of Living Council [COLC]
-Donald H. Rumsfeld
-Shultz
-Departures
-Robert H. Finch
-Rumsfeld
-Flanigan
-Klein
-Timing
-Colson
-Concern about perception
-Watergate
-Conversation with Buchanan
 -36-

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

Tape Subject Log
(rev. Feb.-08)

Conversation No. 225-39 (cont’d)

-Law firm
-Conversation with Laird
-Law firm
-Buchanan
-Sensitivity of position
-Accomplishments
-New Majority
-Retention
-Risk
-Conversation with the President
-Timing
-1972 election
-Possible suit against the press
-Possible suit against the press
-New York Times v. Sullivan
-Possible position as practicing lawyer
-Possible trial
-January 20, 1973
-Announcement
-Interim
-Concern about perception
-Watergate
-Trial
-Impact
-Thelma C. (“Pat”) Nixon’s office
-Michael J. Farrell
-Memorandum
-Plans
-Constance M. (Cornell) (“Connie”) Stuart
-Plans to White House
-John S. Nidecker
-Farrell
-Competence
-Departure from White House
-Nidecker
-Retention
-Walker
-Atomic Energy Commission [AEC]
-Whitaker
-John W. Rollins
 -37-

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

Tape Subject Log
(rev. Feb.-08)

Conversation No. 225-39 (cont’d)

-Ambassadorship to Jamaica
- Ambassadorship to Jamaica
-Vincent de Roulet
-Ambassadorships
-State Department recommendations
-De Roulet
-De Roulet
-Support for the President
-Reports on FSOs
-Charles A. Meyer
-State Department
-Robert C. Hill
-Assistant Secretary for Inter-American Affiars
-New Hampshire
-Ambassadorship to Spain
-Performance
-Loyalty
-Under Secretary
-Loyalty
-Malek
-Carlucci
-Henry Cabot Lodge
-Departure
-Age
-Rockefeller
-Forthcoming telephone call from Ehrlichman
-Meeting with the President [November 21, 1972]
-Timing
-Thanksgiving
-Agenda
-Study
-Ehrlichman’s briefing of the President
-Second term reorganization
-Possible constitutional convention on Federal
reorganization
-Advisory panel on domestic affairs
-Possible chairmanship
-Irving Kristol
-Daniel P. (“Pat”) Moynihan
 -38-

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

Tape Subject Log
(rev. Feb.-08)

Conversation No. 225-39 (cont’d)

The President's schedule
-Meeting with Rogers
-Time
-Second term reorganization
-Plan
-Revision

Second term reorganization
-Rogers
-Difficulty
-Cabinet
-1972 campaign
-Hard work
-Reward
-Retention
-Repaying the President
-Duty

The President’s schedule
-Rogers
-Meeting with President
-Haldeman presence
-Connally

Haldeman left at 3:30 pm

Second term reorganization
-Rockefeller
-Advisory panel on domestic affairs
-Advantages
-Resources
-Views
-Political clout
-“Cosmetics”
-1972 election
-Problems
-New programs
-Summer youth corps
-Rebuilding cities
-Conservatives
 -39-

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

Tape Subject Log
(rev. Feb.-08)

Conversation No. 225-39 (cont’d)

-Human events
-Sapol [sp?] [First name unknown]
-Kristol
-Edward C. Banfield
-Membership
-Mayor
-Rockefeller’s role
-Federal staff
-Purpose
-Revenue sharing
-Ehrlichman’s forthcoming effort
-Interior Department
-Unknown person
-Smokey the Bear
-Robert J. Hitt
-Performance
-Title
-Possible Under Secretary
-Patricia R. Hitt
-Departure
-HEW
-Whitaker
-Loyalty
-Malek
-Loyalty
-Ash
-Work with White House
-Possible Cabinet position
-Possible meeting with the President
-Experience
-HUD
-Mayors, public interest groups
-HUD
-Candidates
-Requirements
-Personal skills
-Cutbacks
-Mortgage bankers
-Collins
-Boston
 -40-

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

Tape Subject Log
(rev. Feb.-08)

Conversation No. 225-39 (cont’d)

-Colson
-Qualifications
-Mayoral performance
-Background
-Irish Catholic Democrat
-View of Edward M. Kennedy
-Polio
-Boston chamber of commerce
-Lecturing
-Harvard University
-Political experience, pragmatism
-Low income housing program
-Romney
-Problems
-Edward W. Brooke
-Congressional amendment [Housing and Urban
Development Act of 1972]
-Rents
-Links to salaries
-Effect on housing authorities
-Reforms
-Voucher system
-Vacant housing
-Effect on housing market
-British program
-Congressional relations
-Timing
-Possible legislation
-Weinberger
-Weinberger
-HEW
-HUD
-HUD
-Preston Martin
-Departure
-Background
-Education
-Lecturing
-Job performance
-Requirements
 -41-

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

Tape Subject Log
(rev. Feb.-08)

Conversation No. 225-39 (cont’d)

-Business management
-Italian-American, Catholic
-Business management
-Malek
-Malek
-Under secretary
-Requirements
-Congressional, mayoral, housing authorities relations
-Romney
-Job performance
-Richard C. Van Dusen
-Cooley
-Background
-Business experience
-Catholicism
-West
-Italian-American
-Justice Department
-Solicitor General
-Unknown Chicago lawyer [Pellettieri?]
-Haldeman’s suggestion
-Southerner
-Wright
-University of Texas
-Busing
-Robert H. Bork
-Background
-Conservatism
-Law professor
-Yale University
-American Enterprise Institute [AEI]
-Civil Rights Division
-Personal appearance
-Beard
-HUD
-Collins
-Housing problem
-Budget
-Collins
-Brooke
 -42-

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

Tape Subject Log
(rev. Feb.-08)

Conversation No. 225-39 (cont’d)

-Alternative
-Midwest
-Personal attributes
-Vigor
-Eberle
-Background
-Boise-Cascade Corporation
-American standard
-Business ability
-Character
-Cooley
-Interior Department
-Italian-American
-Transportation Department
-[Volpe] replacement
-Carlucci
-Presence
-Charisma
-Volpe
-Ambassadorship to Italy
-Romney
-Future with the administration
-Relations with administration
-Conversation with the President
-Plans
-Morton
-Choices
-NATO ambassadorship
-Cabinet rank positions
-First term appointments
-Problems
-UN ambassadorship
-NATO ambassadorship
-David Kennedy
-Counselors
-New Cabinet
-Number
-Functionality
-Compared to honorary status
-Haldeman
 -43-

NIXON PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY AND MUSEUM

Tape Subject Log
(rev. Feb.-08)

Conversation No. 225-39 (cont’d)

-The President's schedule
-1956 elections
-Dwight D. Eisenhower’s schedule
-Camp David
Haldeman
-Florida
-Work
-Klein
-Klein
-Retention
-Ehrlichman
-Retention
-Problem
-Ehrlichman, Haldeman, Kissinger
-Control
-The President’s confidence
-Ehrlichman
-Reappointment
-Criticism
-Domestic affairs
-Public relations

Ehrlichman left at 3:45 pm